[Civilization] SCOTLAND THOUGH

I'm ready go tonight. There's a party, alright. We don't need the raisin for joy, oh yeah. Tick down to midnight.
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Delthazar
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[Civilization] SCOTLAND THOUGH

Post by Delthazar » 7 months ago

Cree!



Props to the Civ art team, Poundmaker looks fuckin' cool as ice.

They sound like a pretty strong trading/diplomacy Civ and their unique border expansion via trade units, especially as early as Pottery, might be my new favourite ability in the game, as I'm super picky about contiguous borders and I hate the AI sniping land too close or behind my lines.

Canada got a shoutout in the video so even if they don't make the cut as a full civ I guess they'll probably at least be in the Cree scenario? It would line up well enough with the time period.

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Re: [Civilization] MISTAH PRIME MINISTAH!

Post by Falcon Critical » 7 months ago

Damn you're right, he looks boss as hell. That trade route land claiming seems pretty cool, you could lay cities in such a way that the trade route will snap up resource tiles without having to pay or wait for border expansion.

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Re: [Civilization] MISTAH PRIME MINISTAH!

Post by Delthazar » 7 months ago

Go figure, 2K/Firaxis didn't reach out to Cree representatives about Poundmaker.

https://www.polygon.com/2018/1/4/168509 ... poundmaker

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Re: [Civilization] MISTAH PRIME MINISTAH!

Post by Falcon Critical » 7 months ago

I wonder if they reached out to the Iroquois and Shoshone when those civs were added to Civ 5. You'd think it would be worth reaching out to historians for each culture as part of their implementation of civs into the game.

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Re: [Civilization] MISTAH PRIME MINISTAH!

Post by Delthazar » 7 months ago

Falcon Critical wrote:I wonder if they reached out to the Iroquois and Shoshone when those civs were added to Civ 5.
I really doubt it, though the Iroquois were a confederation of smaller nations (and Hiawatha lived in the 15th century?) so maybe they're far enough back in history that finding someone specific for consultation beyond a historian is a challenge. People can't even seem to agree on which nation Hiawatha led.

But in the case of Poundmaker I think he's just modern enough of a historical figure to still have direct living descendants. But I doubt 2K/Firaxis is exactly on chatting terms with Gandhi's or John Curtin's remaining family either. A little more diligence would be nice next time, like, make a couple phone calls, at least.

(Never Alone Kisima Inŋitchuŋa is probably still the only video game which got all its ducks in a row.)

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Re: [Civilization] MISTAH PRIME MINISTAH!

Post by Falcon Critical » 7 months ago

Isn't part of the problem the way land is claimed by the civ though? Like if the mongols couldn't make infantry, or if the US could only start an unjust war. You don't have to be related to leader that is depicted to dislike potential stereotypes played into as nation mechanics.

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Re: [Civilization] MISTAH PRIME MINISTAH!

Post by Delthazar » 7 months ago

Yeah, at some point it's more a common sense thing, but since more specific opportunities for consultation exist with the Cree compared to earlier examples like the Iroquois it'd be interesting if those avenues were explored someday.

Civ has always felt like a piece of media that has the potential to be a powerful education tool (and there was a version of Civ V which attempted this more closely) so the more voices they can get in the chorus the better.

e: supposedly, Firaxis talked to the Pueblo nation when they were developing the Civ V expansions and were asked not to put them in, so maybe this time around they decided it's easier to ask forgiveness than to ask for permission. Also supposedly (very supposedly; I have no idea if any of the chatter I see elsewhere has verification) the Cree's music for Civ VI was performed by Cree singers from Poundmaker's extended family and they really enjoyed the experience.

But now that a lot of Canadian media has picked up the story the initial reaction sounds much more tempered than it seemed to be as reported by some of the games press.

https://globalnews.ca/news/3945188/poun ... vilzation/
Tootoosis said the inclusion of Poundmaker is an example of cultural appropriation, but he acknowledged the depiction of the chief shown in the game’s trailer is largely positive.

“I was quite impressed that they would make reference to Chief Poundmaker as a diplomat and as an individual who played a key role in the development of this new nation called Canada,” he said.

Tootoosis also said the game will likely create widespread interest in Poundmaker, which could lead to better public awareness of the Plains Cree.

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Re: [Civilization] MISTAH PRIME MINISTAH!

Post by Delthazar » 7 months ago

Oh hey, Civilization VI is the headline game for the next Humble Monthly bundle. Civ VI + the Viking and Australia DLC for $12 is about the best price for a Civ thing I've ever seen.

https://www.humblebundle.com/monthly

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Re: [Civilization] MISTAH PRIME MINISTAH!

Post by Delthazar » 7 months ago

Tamar of Georgia. Not that Georgia. The other Georgia.


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Re: [Civilization] MISTAH PRIME MINISTAH!

Post by Delthazar » 6 months ago

Rise & Fall features overview. Dunno if there's any new information but it's nice to see it all in motion.


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Re: [Civilization] MISTAH PRIME MINISTAH!

Post by Falcon Critical » 6 months ago

The more they put into era-specific directions and governors, the weirder it seems to me that it remains as a single unchallenged immortal dictatorship. I feel like they're creeping towards Crusader Kings, but then don't have the actual family and local lord politics to make it work. It's one of the most interesting things in actual historical empires, you have an amazing King who inspires the people and brings in cultural golden days, followed by a craven warmonger who peeks over his borders and salivates over his neighbour's mineral wealth.

I know that's not what Civ is about, but it seems like they're trying to dance in that direction and I'm not sure it works. Still, I haven't played the expansion and haven't really played a ton of the base game, and I'm not sure I will.

I think Stellaris sits right in the sweet spot. I know Civ puts a lot of effort into their iconic leaders, and it's a good history lesson to look these people up (Wu Zeitan is fucking rad) but the changing leaders and governors brings in that potential shift in priorities for your entire empire, and the integration of species not being Civ's total assimilation adds interesting decisions as well.

I guess what I'm saying is I should play more Stellaris.

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Re: [Civilization] MISTAH PRIME MINISTAH!

Post by DHerder222 » 6 months ago

Holy crapadoodle, I've been listening to some of the tracks on Civ 6's OST and they are freaking incredible.






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Re: [Civilization] MISTAH PRIME MINISTAH!

Post by Delthazar » 6 months ago

Yeah, Civ's music has been very strong for at least the last couple mainline entries. Especially since they started doing several variants of each theme with increasing compositional complexity to fit each gameplay era, and even more for wartime.

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Re: [Civilization] MISTAH PRIME MINISTAH!

Post by John Layfield » 6 months ago

Unsurprisingly, because I'm a contrary fucker, I found Civ V's soundtrack to be a bit better but VI certainly has some highlights.

Take my two favourite Civ V tracks as my tribute to this topic.




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Re: [Civilization] MISTAH PRIME MINISTAH!

Post by DHerder222 » 6 months ago

Nice, that Brazil theme is pretty awesome too. But maybe I'm biased. :awesome

Notabohr's never really played the series and I've been rusty since Civ2. If we wanted to dip our toes back into the franchise, is Civ VI a good start? Or would another game be less overwhelming for a couple of newbies?

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Re: [Civilization] MISTAH PRIME MINISTAH!

Post by John Layfield » 6 months ago

I think either V or VI are fine for newbies at the basic level, low difficulty stuff.

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Re: [Civilization] MISTAH PRIME MINISTAH!

Post by Delthazar » 6 months ago

Agreed, there ain't much about V or VI that would throw-off newcomers and lapsed players, while III and IV might have age issues by now.

I think the most you'd need to know about Civ V & VI coming from Civ II is that tiles are now hexes, Zone of Control isn't a thing anymore, unit stacks have been eliminated so only one unit of each class can occupy a hex (though you can bind support units to military units, merge military units into corps and armies with the right tech, etc.), and Civ VI specifically has added a new district system for cities, so cities are now larger than a single hex.

You can get Civ VI with some DLC (Australia at least) for $12 right now via Humble Monthly. Ain't likely to see a better price even in Steam sales for quite a while. Then just cancel before the next month if you don't wanna stay subbed.

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Re: [Civilization] MISTAH PRIME MINISTAH!

Post by Falcon Critical » 6 months ago

The thing that annoys me slightly about Civ VI music is that the music you hear will be from whichever nation is winning, rather than the nation you're playing. While that's an interesting idea, I want to immerse myself in the culture of the nation I chose, not be Australia hearing Russian music through the ages.

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Re: [Civilization] MISTAH PRIME MINISTAH!

Post by DHerder222 » 6 months ago

Huh, that is weird. And there's no setting to change that?

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Re: [Civilization] MISTAH PRIME MINISTAH!

Post by Falcon Critical » 6 months ago

Not that I know of, maybe they'll add it in the expansion.

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Re: [Civilization] MISTAH PRIME MINISTAH!

Post by Delthazar » 6 months ago

Hmm, I've definitely noticed other people's music playing at times, but I figured it was a bug. Might be a mod somewhere that cleans that up.

could just win more :pac

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Re: [Civilization] MISTAH PRIME MINISTAH!

Post by Falcon Critical » 6 months ago

Scotland is the latest addition:



"Although Robert can be a powerful military leader, be sure to combat war weariness with golf courses!" Are we talking about the weariness of the people or just the leader at this point :pacdown

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Re: [Civilization] MISTAH PRIME MINISTAH!

Post by John Layfield » 6 months ago

Scotland before Ireland, fuck off. They're not even a real country.

Can't believe that malodorous island has TWO civs. Bloody hell.

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Re: [Civilization] MISTAH PRIME MINISTAH!

Post by Delthazar » 6 months ago

UK BEEF

Glad they got Robert and not William Wallace like people kept speculating. :pac If Scotland is in then I guess the other possible leaks are also true. Zulu are probably next then.

Australia and Scotland before Canada :can

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Re: [Civilization] MISTAH PRIME MINISTAH!

Post by DHerder222 » 6 months ago

Canada might be a stretch, but I don't think there's ever been a northern Native group like the Inuit, has there?